John Colaw: Hello, Neil. You
mention the work of
Zecharia Sitchin in regards to the tenth
and its inhabitants the
Anunnaki, or Nefilim who
genetically engineered us as a species from primitive Homo
Erectus stock around 250,000 - 300,000 years ago in East Africa.
Why does Neil Freer believe the thesis of Zecharia Sitchin when
so many "experts" do not? What prevents people from considering
this, to me, obvious evidence as to the truth of our past? Why
don't people get it?
Neil Freer: I have taught on the college level,
Philosophy and History of Religion, but I have tended to
dissociate myself from the academic world, the world of the
"expert", because of the control by funding so rampant in that
community and the fear of peer pressure to conform to the
"expert" consensus paradigm.
These are the driving factors that
prove out, over and over again, the thesis of Tom Kuhn in his
“The Structure of Scientific Revolutions”: radical new paradigms
are fought, kicking and screaming, regardless of how robust and
clear the evidence is, and only accepted when the old guard dies
So this tendency to tenure tetanus is a primary reason why
the "experts" ignore Sitchin's thesis or try to get him quick
and nasty in personal attacks since they haven't been able to
refute him in 24 years.
A second reason is that the more intelligent of them realize
well that his thesis calls into question not only their data but
a fundamental assumption on which their disciplines are founded.
They accept as unquestioned that the transcultural "gods" known
to all the ancient civilizations were unreal, mythic beings.
Sitchin says, just as
the Sumerians said, that they were flesh
and blood humanoids - and aliens to boot.
Even if they allow themselves to entertain the possibility that
his thesis is correct, they don't want to deal with the
ramifications. It means that we must literally rethink the
entire planet. For an academic scholar to "go first" in a
situation like this is a rare case indeed.
The situation is made even more difficult because of that magic
word "alien". Even though the Anunnaki are from within our solar
system, not from forty light years away like the little grey
guys with wraparound eyes, even though we are half Anunnaki and
they look very much like we look, the fact that they are from
off planet and can be called "alien", the circles get made
'round the ears and the eyes roll in the "expert" academic
community for fear of peers tagging one as a looney-tune.
This is complexified by the fact I emphasized in the white paper I
published on the web recently, “The Alien Question, An Expanded
Perspective”: there are two artificial problems here.
We have an abundance of information and evidence that
demonstrates the alien presence in general on this planet. The
suppression of the entire topic by the government has severely
retarded the academic and scientific communities, an artificial
problem. We have as much or more evidence and information that
we are half alien, a bicameral species brought about through
Anunnaki (alien) genetic engineering. But the suppression
throughout western history by
the Roman Church of that entire
paradigm has created the other artificial problem for scholars
and humans in general.
To balance all this out it is
imperative that I qualify by emphasizing that there are, no
doubt, honest, sincere, scholars and scientists of great
integrity out there who do "get it", who see that Sitchin is
very correct. But it seems that there are not those among them,
so far, who have the courage of military warriors like
Philip Corso, to risk pension, prosecution and
persecution to speak out because they want the truth to prevail.
I became convinced of the correctness and validity of Sitchin's
thesis - just as I have become convinced of the correctness
and validity of Sir
Laurence Gardner's thesis recently
by dry logic or intuition but by its utter coherence: they are
the only explanations which contain no inexplicable elements, no
contradictions and in which all the facts dance together in
To qualify precisely further, I do not agree with Zecharia on an
incidental point or two and find the same holds true with Sir
Laurence's conclusions, but these are peripheral, not essential
core thesis points.
In this massive, revolutionary volume of
material, it would be amazing if there would be total agreement
about details this early on.
John Colaw: In your books, Neil, you speak of "genetic
enlightenment" being the key to unlocking the "godspell". Could
you expand on that please? What is genetic enlightenment, and
what is the godspell?
Neil Freer: I've used the word godspell to characterize the
subservient, submissive attitude, the deepest dye in our
cultural fabric that is the residual slave mentality from our
beginnings as a genetically engineered slave race brought into
being by the Anunnaki for their own practical purposes,
primarily mining gold.
Eventually, we became limited partners
with them, a stable race, and are just coming out of a three
thousand year traumatic transition from racial adolescence.
we were always subject to them and have been standing here
looking up in the sky where they went when they phased off
overtly (heaven became in the sky where they went, hell became
underground where you worked to your death in the gold mines)
looking for daddy to return to make everything right and tell us
what to do again because we must have done something wrong to
make them go away.
Over time we have sublimated one of them, Enlil (Jehovah/YHWH) a
rather disagreeable, harsh, peevish individual, cruel toward
humans, into a cosmic being with infinite characteristics. This
metaphysical cosmification process through the
scholastic theologians has caused a great deal of confusion and
Genetic enlightenment, therefore, is simply the realization and
recognition of our true history as a genetically engineered
species, the primary and cardinal ramification of which is that
religion is the sublimation of the ancient, subservient,
master-slave relationship between us and the Anunnaki.
individually and racially, become genetically enlightened, we
are empowered to
break the godspell and become our own
independent race and, individually, to become our own person,
our own evolutionary artist, ready to go one-on-one with the
John Colaw: For myself, once I have recognized the flesh and
blood characteristics of the Annunaki, "those who from heaven
came down", then I am freed to think from a much broader frame
of reference than what I have been conditioned to operate
within. I, "we" are empowered to tear away the mystical veil of
God as "big daddy in the sky", and forced to deal with the
likelihood of a public extraterrestrial encounter.
Am I anywhere
near the right page on that?
Neil Freer: A major result of that genetic enlightenment is that
we realize that the entire concept of the Roman Church doctrine
of "original sin", besides being a deliberately skewed
translation in the first place, is erroneous. It has been,
however, a chief means of making us dependent on some fearful
God and, therefore, on the Church which claims proprietary
absolute interpretive mandate for what that God wants.
result of that continuation of Enlil's domination we are made to
believe that we cannot evolve although we can degenerate, that
we will sink immediately into depravity without constant
supervision and "salvation" from that God, really cannot know
truth by ourselves because of this deep flaw.
Genetic enlightenment shows us that we are all our own
credentials, our own authorities, that we are really capable of
determining the truth, knowing clearly, for ourselves, are not
dependent on some authority for the truth. So, to give you a
little poke in your half alien ribs, m' Brother, if you mean by
"Am I anywhere near the right page on that?" does your take on
this and mine happen to agree, the answer is Yes. If you are
looking to me as any kind of authority, however, I'm going to
The consideration of the "likelihood of a public
extraterrestrial encounter" is an important one for two reasons:
our attitude toward incoming entities of all types needs to
change for our security before that happens, and that kind of
event seems to be getting very close.
Because we have been literally invented and conditioned to the
subservient godspell slave mentality and have been looking to
the sky for the Anunnaki to return for so long, we put ourselves
in a very vulnerable and dangerous position. If we continue to
tend to look to anything or anyone coming from the sky for
answers, solutions, rescue, salvation of any kind, we are in
danger of getting
Genetic enlightenment and breaking the godspell affords us two critical advantages: a planet wide,
consensual understanding and definition of what a generic human
is and, therefore, a planet wide unity beyond any of the Babel
factors from religion to race that have divided us and made us
If the Anunnaki show up here again, depending on
their attitude toward us or which faction among them is
represented, we could be respectfully approached or we could
find ourselves being issued gold mining tools and/or directed to
Whomever shows up here we should meet as a united planetary
race, confident in our own identity, of an unassailable
integrity, with a mature caution that prompts us to demand
credentials, statements of intention, a discretionary
quarantine, and an exchange of essential information about
customs from justicial protocols, to eating to sex.
We should be
able to identify full humanoids from androids. It is certainly
true that whoever shows up here will mostly certainly be more
advanced technologically and could, if they wished, eat our
lunch so to speak. The Anunnaki, however, although obviously
capable of doing so from the beginning, have not done so.
Clearly the various races that have come here and are here now,
although gradually demonstrating that their technology could
easily overwhelm or wipe us out, have not done so.
Does this mean that we should put caution aside? Certainly not.
But it may indicate that our species' internecine violence is
"unnatural", a product of the divisive Babel-factoring for crowd
control that has carried through to great wars and the religious
mayhem of crusades, jihads, inquisitions and persecutions and
not intrinsically of human nature.
I think it points clearly to
the simple fact that the farther along in consciousness
evolution and intelligence and technological advancement a
"natural" race evolves, the more it evolves toward the golden
rule, a modern specific application of which is already in our
consciousness in the Star Trek "prime directive".
John Colaw: Neil, won't the "powers that be", particularly
religious and political, oppose any moves towards "genetic
enlightenment" of the general population? Do we just wait for
the old guard to die out as we educate the new generations? Or
perhaps this eventual awakening is an inevitability that cannot
be entirely prevented?
Neil Freer: The Roman Church, a continuation of the fear of the
god, Enlil, type of subservient religion, came into ascendance
by an alliance with and gradual assimilation of the Roman empire
and adopting its muscular tactics. Suppression of our true
history through the promulgation of the Hebrew Old Testament
forgeries done to make Enlil their single monotheistic deity was
so effective that it effected a sort of racial amnesia and the
ancient Sumerian culture literally was forgotten and only
rediscovered in the late 1800's - at least as far as Western
culture as we have been taught and known it is concerned.
In modern times, the military and political controllers have
suppressed the knowledge and data about alien presence on this
planet by denial and ridicule, at first sincerely because it was
on the basis of friend or foe, as Philip Corso has pointed out
so well in “The Day After Roswell”, and anything that could
outperform our airplanes and fly over our secret sites with
impunity were de facto considered hostile.
There was a fear that
it would disrupt our entire society radically, even chaotically.
Subsequently, I think I agree with Edgar Mitchell, they have not
been totally suppressing, but letting it out indirectly a little
bit at a time.
So the direct and simple answer to your question, I think, is
Yes, they oppose genetic enlightenment, obviously more so
Roman Church because its very nature and existence is
threatened. But certain signals of recent date seem to indicate
a significant turn in this regard.
Roman Church has just
reiterated officially that the Pope is still the only one with a
direct red phone line to Yahweh’s private saucer while, at the
same time, the Pope’s friend, Msgr.
unofficially, but neither unfrocked nor poisoned, goes about
publicly acknowledging that Sitchin is right and the Anunnaki
are coming back soon and Catholics are to be gotten ready for
And, oh yes, the Pope would really like to make a pilgrimage (!)
to Ur. In Iraq. One of the oldest cities founded by the
Anunnaki. A pilgrimage. Oh, really.
We definitely must educate the new generations: It's the
children that must be our focus. We have lost far too many
generations to the godspell handicap already, including our own.
We should not wait for the old guard or the new to pass. We need
to take on our own responsibility for our own lives.
John Colaw: What do you think of the idea that we are already
engaged in a long term conditioning of the population towards an
eventual disclosure of the extraterrestrial presence?
Neil Freer: I think it is a simple, indisputable fact. I think
that it would have progressed much faster if we hadn't been
under the godspell for so long because we would have been ready
much sooner. Many of our problems may be unique to us as a
species synthesized for slave purposes.
But I also am convinced
that, until we get to a consensual, generic definition of human
nature and a planetary unity and an unassailable, mature racial
integrity we simply won't be allowed into stellar society.
John Colaw: Any comments on the “Evil Invader ET” versus the
“Benevolent Space Brother ET” schools of thought? This is major
disagreement in UFOlogy.
Neil Freer: As above with regard to being slavishly vulnerable
and getting Borged.
John Colaw: Mr. Sitchin has shown us where there are
instructions given by a Babylonian King as how to tell a real
Anunnaki from one of their "androids" or robots. Do you think
this may offer an explanation as to who
the Greys are that
appear to be here? Could they be remote or artificial servants
of the Anunnaki?
Neil Freer: There are several fascinating elements embedded in
this topic. It is quite clear from the records that the Anunnaki
were technologically advanced enough, at least in the latter
times they were here, to develop and use robots if not androids
sophisticated enough to require instruction on how to
distinguish them from the Anunnaki, much less humans.
(Tangentially, our recognition of these facts, just as our
recognition of the astrophysics of our solar system's formation
contained in the
Enuma Elish, and their knowledge and use of
monoatomic elements, would facilitate our own advancement in
There is indication from depictions that some of
those robots and/or androids resembled the Greys well known to
The question is whether the aliens we have experience of in our
times are sourced in the Anunnaki or from somewhere else. What
sources of reliable information do we have that may shed light
on this matter? (U.S. Command Sgt. Major, Ret.) Robert O. Dean,
my good friend whose honesty is unquestioned in my opinion, has
revealed that the secret NATO alien studies he was privy to
during the cold war said that there were some twelve races known
to be here (even then in the '60's), from Nordic types to rather
strange grey types.
We can cross reference this with the affirmation by Philip Corso
that the aliens recovered from the crash at Roswell were
androids (by autopsy evidence and, probably, from interaction
with live ones ) who (which?) had four lobes to their brains.
Further, most reports from
contactees seem to indicate that the
aliens approaching them were from outside our solar system. But
this leaves us without definite specific determinations. My own
current subjective evaluation is that probably most of the
aliens reported and the crews of alien craft sighted are
extra-solar system based but a few or less are quite probably
It would seem logical and apparent that, if at whatever point
they had mastered
anti-gravity (rather than having to rely on the
old ballistic, rocket technology that brought them here
originally - and which lost 50 of them in an accident coming
here on one trip from the home planet
Nibiru) they would have
routinely monitored this planet and us.
The most obvious
correlation of saucer sightings with the Anunnaki would seem to
be the sensational display over Mexico beginning in 1991 with
the major eclipse of the sun. The Dresden codices of the Maya
made the prediction that at the time of that "sixth sun"
eclipse, which they knew how to easily predict, there would be
manifestations in the heavens related to the "gods" and
significant earth changes in that area.
The Anunnaki were the teachers of that remarkable civilization
and their astronomy instructors. Saucers in the sky and the
dangerous Popocateptl volcano awakening, threatening the largest
city in the world, Mexico City, certainly fulfilled the
"prophecy", more a matter of fact prediction as scientifically
determinable as an eclipse with Anunnaki science.
this was a clear announcement of presence, and may presage the
return of the Anunnaki personally, and perhaps, as some are
claiming the government and the Church already know, the return
to the inner solar system of Nibiru itself.
John Colaw: Neil, have you had a personal UFO sighting or
paranormal encounter that you would care to share? Do you think
there may be
here on Earth now?
Neil Freer: That's a whole other story in itself. Those who want
to subject themselves to a bit of it are encouraged to read my
piece in David Pursglove's excellent symposium “Zen In The Art
Of Close Encounters”.
I think it is extremely possible that some of the Anunnaki/Nefilim
may be here now.
As Zecharia has replied more than once,
makes you think they ever left?"
It's an intriguing matter to
consider how some of them may have remained and are among us
yet, maybe low profile, maybe living in isolated areas - or
perhaps in the Pentagon....
Bob Dean said that was a fact
mentioned in the NATO report - that some of the aliens were so
much like us that we couldn't tell and they could be in the
halls of the Pentagon - that totally freaked the generals
and the officials privy to the reports.
John Colaw: Where does one find sanity in thinking forward past
the implications of "Sitchin Shock", as the truth begins to sink
in? Isn't that a tremendous leap of courage, to upset one's
paradigm in such a manner by considering such an outrageous
explanation, even though one supported by the facts at hand? How
do we deal with this heavy culture shock?
Neil Freer: Sanity in any of this is found in the recognition
that our questions have been sane all along and that the
insanity lies with those who have perpetrated the artificial
histories and cultural lies. Humor, ultimately, is the key.
The Brookings study (think tank, engaged by the government) early on said, don't reveal the alien presence to the public
because it will cause total disruption of the churches and
society through the "culture shock". That was then and perhaps,
at first, that was true and the right thing to do.
after Roswell, with thousands of videotape records of saucers in
clear daylight, the technological ability to do ourselves all
the things from using particle beam weapons to genetically
engineering a human that formerly allowed us to think the
Anunnaki were mythic beings doing utterly fantastic deeds, and
the revelation of our true history through Sitchin's work, we
are more than ready.
The shock to those who cannot believe the
government would lie to them for so long so horrendously when
the admission is made will be greater at this point.
John Colaw: Do you have any thoughts regarding
prophecy, or End Times prophecy? Are the "End of Days" possibly
the potential return of the planet Nibiru? Do you think maybe
they have already found Planet Nibiru, as indicated by the IRAS
reports in '83-'84? Could they already be expecting it?
Neil Freer: Take all the predictions from every quarter -
except, perhaps, those lifted whole and literal from the
terrible translations and fundamentalist misunderstandings and
misinterpretations of the New Testament - about the "end
times", from catastrophic earth changes, to signs in the sky, to
the aquarian conspiracy evolving into a celebration and roll
them into one. They are already happening.
But those changes and
events will be subsumed by the restoration of our true history
and the advent, thereby, by a new human and a new human society.
John Colaw: You mention the importance of ooparts (out of place
artifacts), in providing clues to us of still unknown realities.
What are a couple of the more enigmatic ooparts that you find
especially intriguing, and what do they imply to you?
Neil Freer: The 4500 year old cylinder seal RV/243 in the East
Berlin Museum showing all the planets in our Solar system, and
model aircraft and rocket ships, and the
depicting even a helicopter, or the
monoatomic gold processing
plant on Mount Horeb immediately come to mind.
But they are
totally clear and understandable.
Actually there is only a single enigmatic one that I can think
of right now, the Anunnaki practice of interpreting oil on
water. It is mentioned more than once as ranked right up there
with the "secrets" of their advanced science.
Just as the
principles of the I Ching, the book of changes, was probably
Anunnaki inspired - it is a model of the human psyche embodied
in sixty four gestalts, expressed as hexagrams, all of which,
through internal changes, transmute predictively into any other,
so, perhaps - I can only guess, at this point - they had
learned to scientifically and methodically predict physical
events by indications caused by subtle influences on the
behavior of oil floating practically friction less on water.
have worked with the I Ching for forty years and am still
learning from it. I would like to know the secret of observing
oil on water.
John Colaw: I read a comment from
Timothy Leary on your website.
Do you have an interesting Timothy Leary story?
Neil Freer: Tim was a good friend. Tim was an advanced futant
(his coined word: future mutant) psychologist. He was the
One of the sanest, if not the sanest person I
have known. He pioneered the potential of LSD to enable a person
to rewire their own switchboard right down to the level of
redoing biological imprint (the neurological snapshot the child
takes of the mother object in that small window after birth).
their own initiative under good set and setting individuals
could travel the highest of the "mystical" realms, experience
four-dimensional consciousness, look through the head of a
parent, of the psychiatrist, the priest, the doctor, the lawyer,
the criminal and the drill sergeant.
And break the godspell.
There were more PhD's per square foot at the big house in
Millbrook from all over the world each weekend than on college
campuses because they knew he had found the psychological grail
- until Gordon Liddy began hiding in the bushes and breaking
into bedrooms to buy his career ticket to Watergate. He fought
Irish tough for the freedom of the individual to manage his own
As a result he was declared by a judge in
California to be the most dangerous individual on the planet and
eventually put through 25 jails as a political prisoner,
beginning with a half ounce of grass planted in his car's trunk.
It took hundreds of years before the Church apologized to
Galileo. I hope that it won't take that long or even the time
it took to begin to understand
Tesla, before we recognize
John Colaw: When we spoke at the Sitchin banquet a few weeks ago
in Santa Fe, NM, you mentioned some amazing new trends in
artificial intelligence. If computers/artificial intelligence
become self-referential as suggested by Ray Kurzweil in "The Age
of Spiritual Machines", won't the next step be for the computers
themselves to play their own "God Games"?
self-referential, and what does it imply for artificial
In your opinion, Neil, can a machine have a soul, an electronic
"ego" or self?
Neil Freer: Let's leave this for another interview. There is so
much to this topic that we couldn't even scratch the surface
John Colaw: It seems to me that if we are a hybrid race,
bicameral mutants evolved at an accelerated pace, then we are
out of synch with the natural evolution of our planet due to the
tinkering of our genes by the Anunnaki. How can we get past this
and unite globally as a species and get over our petty local
differences and grievances? Don't we need to grow up quickly and
prepare to interact with extraterrestrials?
Neil Freer: Part of becoming genetically enlightened is that we
will recognize ourselves as part indigenous Homo Erectus, and
part off-planet Anunnaki. This frees us to identify, understand
and integrate both those components in our individual and
This self-knowledge will finally afford us
the opportunity of literal self-reconciliation, to learn the
focus and rhythms of both our racial genomes. We will learn from
our Terran Homo Erectus wisdom to tune to the Earth again, to
respect and project this planet as a great place to live and a
great place to visit, as we learn from our Anunnaki heritage how
to enter space and become first solar system and then stellar
I don't see the unification of the species globally as a true
problem as much as I see it as an artificial one, ubiquitously
and assiduously kept in place by the power and suppression of
the Roman Church and reinforced by the power plays of
manipulative governments and economic interests.
When they can no longer maintain,
the Church is now dissembling - shuckin' and jivin' in plain language - as
gradually and quietly as possible in order to transform and
still maintain power. If the Pope wants officially to go to Ur
on pilgrimage and Msgr. Balducci says Catholics are to be gotten
ready for the return of the Anunnaki - and how would they
know that in the first place?
If that happens, I think the
domino effect from the genetic enlightenment that will occur
will be rapid - and come as a great relief rather than as a
A practical advantage, the topic of a white paper I just
addressed to individuals in the genome project arena, is clearly
the insight available to us in our genome read out and research.
The geneticists would do well to be at least on the lookout for
signs of the melding of the two codes that make up our genome.
Knowledge of the genetic engineering that created us might
provide shortcuts to understanding the fact that we have some
4000 plus and counting genetic diseases or defects - when
other species on this planet have only a very few.
John Colaw: Do you have any new insights to add to your
Neil Freer: I'm almost embarrassed to call any of this insights.
I think of anything I have realized and articulated more in
terms of bullheaded affirmative statements of obvious, simple
hard facts in the face of a powerful, orchestrated deception by
retrogressive religious and political power players - many of
whom, I'm sure, never realized that they were doing that because
of remoteness from the original source and being trained in a
tradition that so thoroughly removes the sense of an outside.
The revelations of Sir Laurence Gardner in his recent
of the Holy Grail and
Genesis of the Grail Kings, of the nature
and beginnings and history of the heterodox, other side, of
Christianity and its preservation of a bloodline of leaders as
servants of the people, initiated by Enki to take the Anunnaki's
place, when they phased off is where to look for profound
"insights" right now.
He has taken up where Zecharia left off,
clearly delineating the bloodline all the way back to Sumer and
revealing its sustenance through the
Starfire and then the
monoatomic gold. As he has so succinctly put it,
there was no dark ages except for those who were kept in the
dark. He has allowed the heterodox tradition to come out of the
woodwork where it has been in seclusion since withdrawing to
avoid being destroyed by the Inquisition.
Another recent source of a great deal of insight is the work of
Barbara Thiering, the Australian theologian, who has
single-handedly explicated the
Dead Sea Scrolls and
material in a brilliant tour de force. Her book, “Jesus the
Man”, is an important source referred to by Gardner.
John Colaw: What does Neil Freer have planned for the future? Is
there a new book in the works?
Neil Freer: Changes are happening so fast these days,
exponentially in most cases, that white papers and interviews
like these that go out over the web world wide and free in a
matter of a day seem far more to the point.
The white paper,
Alien Question: An Expanded Perspective, that I put out last
October has gotten response from China, Malaysia, Australia,
Brazil, most of Europe, Turkey and Zaire, is being translated
right now into Indonesian and soon into Japanese.
My personal plan for the present and the future - the
phenomenon and the restoration of our true history is all really
boring old hat, I'm focused on the present and the future -
is to live as if I were a citizen of the twenty second century,
as my own evolutionary artist, consciously evolving, playing my
own God Games.
I have chosen to be immortal. To that end I am signed up with
Alcor (Phoenix, AZ) for cryogenic suspension in the event that
the biotechies don't get the immortality act perfected for us
through nanotech and genetic engineering before I have to book
it, although I think it may well happen. That's why the subtitle
of God Games is What Do You Do Forever?. I'm exploring how I'll
want to live as an immortal.
Death, currently, is the Great
Conditioner. We are subliminally or consciously influenced in
our choices and life decisions by that inevitability. When
immortal, to continue with the short term grabbing at a bit of
pleasure and satisfaction out of life would be a horror. I think
the only thing that doesn't satiate is constant, leisurely (bad
pun) expansion of consciousness and information.
definitely done much better and with much more fun dyadically,
equal partners moving tantrically up the evolutionary DNA spiral
together, as we evolve rapidly, individually and collectively to
an expanded, habitual, four-dimensional consciousness and
John Colaw: One last question, Neil. What is the sound of a one hand
Neil Freer: Yes. [sound of two persons laughing]
John Colaw: Thanks!
Neil Freer: My pleasure.